a Kawa wikipedia page would be cool...

[David Pirotte]

Hello,

I just edited this page, to add a kawa external link reference in two locations on
the page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hy

Doing so, I realize Kawa does not have its own wikipedia page: I don't have time to
do it, neither do I think I'm the right person to do it correctly, but it might be
good to ...

Cheers,
David

[Per Bothner]

Post by David Pirotte
I just edited this page, to add a kawa external link reference in two locations on
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hy

Actually, it does:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawa_(Scheme_implementation)

I notice that various people have been adding to / updating, for which I
am very grateful. It could do with more love, though.

[David Pirotte]

Hi Per,

Post by Per Bothner
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawa_(Scheme_implementation)

Ah, I did enter 'kawa' in the search box of the hy wikipedia page before to post
here, and it does not list anything about Kawa_(Scheme_...). I just tried again
using the search box of the kawa page, just to confirm, and same 'no match'

Maybe worth a word with the wikipedia folks...

I really don't like the 1st sentence, because it gives the impression it is for
language implementors only, where as, imo, kawa is a scheme implementation, first
and before anything else, that allows programmers _not_ to have write java (the
clojure 'slogan, nobody should never have to write java code...)

The page should really be reviewed, to make it extremely attractive, and _the_
language that one would want to use if they have to do anything in java ... it
should also explains the advantages it has over clojure (start-up time and a so much
better integration with the java class system ...

all this with real example, a real complete little app...

a 2D clock, as I wrote for guile-clutter might be a good example, and how one
could run it in java, and android ... maybe :)

http://www.nongnu.org/grip/examples.html

Then it says

To run Kawa on GNU/Linux:

$ export CLASSPATH=$CLASSPATH:/path/to/kawa/kawa-1.10.jar

1.10 ? ...

Voilà :) my 2c

Not me though, I'm totally over loaded with my GNU projects and rarely use
kawa anyway (I do when I have to use imagej, precisely because I
don't want to write in java...

One of the superior advantage of kawa to clojure is that we don't even need
to interact with the java ecosystem, just kawa -C mycode.scm > mycode.Class
then we can import and, you feel like you are in Guile, or Racket

All we need is emacs, and a repl, then geiser:

Per, any progress on dynamic (re)compilation? not a big deal, just
curious

It is just that I am irritated to see clojure every where and never kawa, which is
so much better ... so today I did my part and added this entry in the HY page :):)

Cheers,
David

[Per Bothner]

Post by David Pirotte
Hi Per,

Post by Per Bothner
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawa_(Scheme_implementation)

Ah, I did enter 'kawa' in the search box of the hy wikipedia page before to post
here, and it does not list anything about Kawa_(Scheme_...). I just tried again
using the search box of the kawa page, just to confirm, and same 'no match'
Maybe worth a word with the wikipedia folks...
I really don't like the 1st sentence, because it gives the impression it is for
language implementors only, where as, imo, kawa is a scheme implementation, first
and before anything else, that allows programmers _not_ to have write java (the
clojure 'slogan, nobody should never have to write java code...)

I vaguely remember there were two pages: 'Kawa (Scheme implementation)'
and 'Kawa (Language framework)' (or something like that). Did someone try to merge
those two pages.

To me, as an implementor, Kawa isn't just a Scheme implementation. There are
other languages implemented using the Kawa framework - some but not all included
with the Kawa source release.

However, for most people, Kawa is interesting an actual Scheme-variant programming language.
So perhaps the first paragraph should focus on that. A second paragraph, maybe something like:

The Kawa compiler tools can be used to implement other languages, some
of which (such as an implementation for XQuery 1.0) are included in the Kawa distribution.

Post by David Pirotte
The page should really be reviewed, to make it extremely attractive, and _the_
language that one would want to use if they have to do anything in java ... it
should also explains the advantages it has over clojure (start-up time and a so much
better integration with the java class system ...
all this with real example, a real complete little app...
a 2D clock, as I wrote for guile-clutter might be a good example, and how one
could run it in java, and android ... maybe :)
http://www.nongnu.org/grip/examples.html
Then it says
$ export CLASSPATH=$CLASSPATH:/path/to/kawa/kawa-1.10.jar
1.10 ? ...

I fixed that.

Post by David Pirotte
Voilà :) my 2c
Not me though, I'm totally over loaded with my GNU projects and rarely use
kawa anyway (I do when I have to use imagej, precisely because I
don't want to write in java...
One of the superior advantage of kawa to clojure is that we don't even need
to interact with the java ecosystem, just kawa -C mycode.scm > mycode.Class
then we can import and, you feel like you are in Guile, or Racket
Per, any progress on dynamic (re)compilation? not a big deal, just
curious

None so far. I've been focused on DomTerm (http://domterm.org/) - adding
tmux/screen-style session management. After that I think the priority
is moving the Language Server along for IDE support. (Both of these have
synergies with the dynamic recompilation goal.)

Post by David Pirotte
It is just that I am irritated to see clojure every where and never kawa, which is
so much better ... so today I did my part and added this entry in the HY page :):)

Imagine how I feel ...

[Damien Mattei]

i'm interesting since a few years about LisP and Scheme that targets the
JVM and there exists a few project about this but only Kawa for Scheme and
Clojure for LisP seems to be running well (i haven't test ABCL armed bear
common Lisp).
About Clojure his success seems based,in my opinion, on the fact that
despite Scheme there is still a big community with LisP and Common Lisp.
If someone search a Scheme compatible with Java i think the sole good
implementation is Kawa. It seems that LisP as still a big community because
it was prior to Scheme, i leant LisP before Scheme, i did not understand
why Scheme? as LisP is so good instead, Clojure is not Lisp but has dragged
a lot of fan i think, Scheme is more young as language, the macro system
has evolves from define-macro to define-syntax instead Lisp use always the
same old macro system but even me i again attracted by Lisp because it was
the "origin" :-)

Damien

Post by Per Bothner

Post by David Pirotte
Hi Per,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawa_(Scheme_implementation)
Ah, I did enter 'kawa' in the search box of the hy wikipedia page before to post
here, and it does not list anything about Kawa_(Scheme_...). I just tried again
using the search box of the kawa page, just to confirm, and same 'no match'
Maybe worth a word with the wikipedia folks...
I really don't like the 1st sentence, because it gives the impression it is for
language implementors only, where as, imo, kawa is a scheme
implementation, first
and before anything else, that allows programmers _not_ to have write java (the
clojure 'slogan, nobody should never have to write java code...)

I vaguely remember there were two pages: 'Kawa (Scheme implementation)'
and 'Kawa (Language framework)' (or something like that). Did someone try to merge
those two pages.
To me, as an implementor, Kawa isn't just a Scheme implementation. There are
other languages implemented using the Kawa framework - some but not all included
with the Kawa source release.
However, for most people, Kawa is interesting an actual Scheme-variant
programming language.
So perhaps the first paragraph should focus on that. A second paragraph,
The Kawa compiler tools can be used to implement other languages, some
of which (such as an implementation for XQuery 1.0) are included in the
Kawa distribution.
The page should really be reviewed, to make it extremely attractive, and

Post by David Pirotte
_the_
language that one would want to use if they have to do anything in java ... it
should also explains the advantages it has over clojure (start-up time and a so much
better integration with the java class system ...
all this with real example, a real complete little app...
a 2D clock, as I wrote for guile-clutter might be a good example, and how one
could run it in java, and android ... maybe :)
http://www.nongnu.org/grip/examples.html
Then it says
$ export CLASSPATH=$CLASSPATH:/path/to/kawa/kawa-1.10.jar
1.10 ? ...

I fixed that.

Post by David Pirotte
Voilà :) my 2c
Not me though, I'm totally over loaded with my GNU projects and rarely use
kawa anyway (I do when I have to use imagej, precisely because I
don't want to write in java...
One of the superior advantage of kawa to clojure is that we don't even need
to interact with the java ecosystem, just kawa -C mycode.scm > mycode.Class
then we can import and, you feel like you are in Guile, or Racket
Per, any progress on dynamic (re)compilation? not a big deal, just
curious

None so far. I've been focused on DomTerm (http://domterm.org/) - adding
tmux/screen-style session management. After that I think the priority
is moving the Language Server along for IDE support. (Both of these have
synergies with the dynamic recompilation goal.)
It is just that I am irritated to see clojure every where and never kawa,

Post by David Pirotte
which is
so much better ... so today I did my part and added this entry in the HY page :):)

Imagine how I feel ...
--
--Per Bothner